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Front wheel bearing of death

9K views 33 replies 10 participants last post by  andrewinbriz 
#1 ·
Hi. Bike is a 2009 1198. 24,500 klm. Used. I've had it for a year. First time needed a front tyre. Took the wheel off to take to tyre shop. Got back home, replaced the front brake pads, and went to replace the wheel bearings. I've replaced bearings on lots of different bikes. One side tapped out ok. The LHS very tight. The bearing collapsed, leaving the outer race in the hub. Hard to get a drift thru the wheel, over the seat, onto the race, but I bent a screwdriver to make it. Used heat too. Would not budge. I have 3 different pullers, but none would work on the 2/3mm wall of the outer race. Used a dremel to make about 6 cuts the width of the bearing, thinking that would break the tension on the bearing, and I could still tap the bits out. But that freakin race is welded in there.
WTF?? Never ever had this happen before. I'm curious about what caused this. If my attachments work, see the metal missing inside the fork leg (at about 7 o'clock). Surely not a coincidence, as it is that side wheel bearing that is a pain.
Any ideas on how to get this freakin bearing out??
 

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#2 · (Edited)
The crack in the fork bottom is normal, that race stays in there. It's how the axel pinching assembly works.

In terms of the race stuck in the wheel, gotta keep hitting it from the opposite side until it pops out.
 
#7 ·
The crack in the axel mount (fork bottom) is very strange. I'd love to see what it looks like underneath, if it's cracked all the way through or not. But if it is cracked all the way through I would absolutely replace it because that's a critical element and it must be secure. .
Tye, do you mean this crack, in red?
 

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#3 ·
Thank you for taking the time to reply. It sure is depressing looking at the damage by fools with a spanner. The nut didn't seem excessively tight when I removed it for the tyre change. But with the klms done, it might have been thru 3 or 4 or 5 front tyres, so damage could have been done earlier. The outer race will not come out. I could tap like a woodpecker for a thousand years, but can get enough force (I have to come tru the wheel, over the seat, and curve onto the couple of mm wall of the outer race).
Talking to a couple of friends, they say to either weld a piece inside the race, so you have a straight blow thru the wheel to tap it out), or drill it out (but it's a 46 point something mm diameter hole, so that is one hell of a drill bit). Will try to weld first.
The more I look at the damage inside the fork leg, the more worried I get. I thought it was some idiot beating on the axle with a sledgehammer when installing the wheel (chipping the inside of the leg, and slightly cocking the bearing), but your explanation of over-tightening makes more sense. But that would be insane over-tightening. Maybe a rattle gun.
I'm actually looking on ebay for a used front wheel now, and used, maybe ohlins, forks!
Anyway, your help was much appreciated. Thank you.
 

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#4 · (Edited)
Sorry about your problem… it kinda sucks. I've seen this before on other motorcycles, but never had a problem getting it out. I mean, you can keep at it and if you destroy something, simply buy a used wheel as you said.
 
#8 ·
Sorry my bad, the crack is to give a gap for the axel's pinch bolts to grab the axel, it's totally normal.

I honestly had never really examined the OEM Showa bottoms before, had no reason to.
 
#11 · (Edited)
No the missing metal is at 7 o'clock. Look at the photo in my second post.
A drag racing friend of mine is coming around and we're going to lunch, Sunday morning here in oz, so I'll get him to have a look. EDIT: I just bought a second hand wheel on ebay. Rubber Side Up. He's agreed to remove the bearings before despatching it. The first guy I contacted refused to remove the bearings. Said it was used and if there was a problem wih a bearing, it was my problem. But I want to buy a used wheel, not a fucked bearing that can't be removed from the wheel.
Thanks to all for your interest.
 
#14 ·
No the missing metal is at 7 o'clock. Look at the photo in my second post.
A drag racing friend of mine is coming around and we're going to lunch, Sunday morning here in oz, so I'll get him to have a look.
The hole is there normally, the little bit of aluminum missing from the edge of the hole is fine. Maybe someone over-tightened at one point, nothing to be too concerned over.
 
#16 ·
Come on Bob, go easy on the bloke huh.

Do you know how hard it must be being the only qualified person here who gives a shit to answer 20 to 30 threads a day with quality answers?

It was nothing but a harmless graduate Engineer/Ducati Master Tech mistake. I see it all the time.

It's the reason why he's not allowed (not banned) from all the other forums. When you multiply that out, his quality of work is bound to suffer. In between that and working on & riding nearly every Ducati model ever made plus all the tyre testing he does... little mistakes are bound to happen. Just let it go and move on please Bob.

Remember, in his defense, he was most likely multi-tasking as well. Replying to the thread, drafting an email to the CEO of Ducati letting them know where they went wrong (again) as well as doing the metallurgy calculations in his head. Simple mistake. :shrug:
 
#17 ·
Yes - shades of Led Zeppelin's 'The Song Remains the Same'.

There has been some pretty untoward stuff happen to that front axle set-up.

The replacement wheel seems an expensive fix, but I understand your frustration.

For the future, I always warm these wheels up to change bearings, coming out and going in. (I have done a few). And I have a special drift I made to remove them. Not much help now the inner bearing is gone.

But if you make a suitable metal plate out of 6 mm steel, with curved ends, and arc weld it into the bearing, it should come out. The weld will actually shrink the part, and the heat will help release it.

Not sure what caused the loss of metal in the fork leg's axle hole. Someone must have done something a bit strange to it. And yes - it may be connected to the seized bearing, being on the same side.

As to how to warm the wheel up to remove/refit bearings? I simply put the wheel in the back window parcel shelf of my car, facing north on a sunny day (south in the northern hemisphere of course)!

After an hour or two you will need gloves to handle the wheel. I prefer to change bearings while the wheel does not have a tyre fitted. And I put the new bearings in the freezer for a bit before fitting them.

These wheels have a pretty tight interference fit. But not as tight as your LH one, obviously!

Good luck with it. A careful clean-up with an engineer's scraper to remove any high spots out of the hole in the fork leg is about all you can do, short of replacing the lower fork leg.

But so long as it clamps the axle and nut firmly you should be OK.
 
#18 ·
Bob...

Yeah, you are prolly a little more understanding of the "tuner" than I. I kinda figure if you are trying to "help" some member, then that action presupposes a bit of expertise. Of corse I have been "warned" about using the word "expert", but I regress.... Suffice it to say, help often requires a knowledge of the problem, anything less, in my experience, compounds the issue, which in regards to motorcycles, riding or racing them, can be a serious situation. Now I realize multi-tasking is all the buzz these days, but sometimes it is best to slow down, look very closely at the issue, and ask myself... Do I really know what the fuck is going on.... or am I just a fucking moron who ought take take my fingers off the keyboard and go find something else to do.
Kinda an eternal question..... just sayin! :shrug:
 
#19 ·
Since I intend keeping the bike, the special drift is a good idea. Drag racing friend took my old wheel. Said he could remove the bearing. Looks like I'm going to have a spare front wheel. He's a car mechanic also, a really competent mechanic. Said he wouldn't be too concerned about the fork leg, but to clean up the area around the missing part with the dremel, as cracks tend to develop in such situations where the area isn't dressed, smoothed out. I do heat the hub when installing or removing the bearing (and always put the bearing in the freezer for 30 mins when installing). I have changed about 30 over my life, and never had this problem before. And always use a torque wrench. I never guess. And clean any threads, and use grease/loctite/prayer/juggling, as per manual. I know there are different opinions, but I always put a light smear of never seize on the bearing seat when installing. Never had any problems by doing this, over half a dozen bikes. But I guess this situation was caused by crazy over-tightening.
By the way, enjoy the banter. Kind of like sideshow bob meets steve carell!
 
#21 ·
I find it really odd that material that's missing inside is like a hole, a perfect circle....almost as if it was drilled for some reason before, and then put in the bottom fork leg.

Oh and yeah about that crack...can't believe Tye was even discussing that. "I've never had a reason to inspect the Showa forks"...their forks! Same as any other, you still need to pinch an axle through it, doesn't matter who makes them! lol....and he claims to be a knowledgeable expert. I wouldn't trust him with something simple as an oil change!
 
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#22 · (Edited)
Oh and yeah about that crack...can't believe Tye was even discussing that. "I've never had a reason to inspect the Showa forks"...their forks! Same as any other, you still need to pinch an axle through it, doesn't matter who makes them! lol....and he claims to be a knowledgeable expert. I wouldn't trust him with something simple as an oil change!
It was a mistake, I misunderstood what I was seeing visually, based on the equipment I'm intimately familiar with and work on every week.

I apologized and since in this case, my information was completely erroneous and incorrect, I decided there was no reason for it to continue existing so I simply edited the posting.
 
#23 ·
^^^ :laughing::laughing::laughing: So why did you have to go back and edit all your posts after AussieBob called you out??? Hell, you spend as much time editing/modifying, to correct your posts, as you do composing!!! I am like Rubbish, I wouldn't let/trust you to check the oil level in my motor!!.... just sayin :shug:
 
#25 ·
Wow and I thought the "editing" post was just a myth.

Why would you go back and edit your post other than a typo?
Nope, believe it or not, editing out the "wrong", "incorrect", "inappropriate", etc.etc. after being called out by a member. Which is why some folks copy, thru "quote" to have a history of the discussion,.... sad, but true!! Then there is also the "modifying post" action.... whatever!!! I personally have only "edited" my post for grammatical, punctuation, etc. reasons when proof reading the post. I do not for a second feel a reason to go back and "make right" my post. I have had many posts "deleted/edited" by the moderator/administrator, but that's another story........ Just sayin.......
 
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#34 ·
Just an update:
I thought I had cut thru the outer race. I hadn't cut fully thru. My friend did, leaving only a very slight mark on the inside wall of the hub. Outer race cut thru, and then can be easily tapped out.
If this ever happens to me again, I now know what to do.
So I've got a spare front Marchesini rim. If anyone in Australia is interested, let me know.
Cheers all.
 

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