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Discussion Starter #1
Hi Guys.

Dropped the oil on my 1098 today and found a fair bit of bronze particles in the sump oil. No magnetic particles.
I cut open the oil filter and there were a few flecks of bronze there but not a lot.
I removed the suction strainer and there are a few largish bits there.
It says big end bearing to me but it seemed to be running ok and no real history that would explain it.
although the oil pressure light did flash on briefly on a long ride up north between the last oil change and this one, oil level was good. engine souned good, and I checked the oil pressure when I got home and it was good. So I replaced the oil pressure switch.

Can anyone out there think of anything less expensive made from bronze that is inside the crankcases that might be the source of this debris.

Note I ALWAYS look at the contents of drained oil container and cut open the oil filters to see what is inside when I change oil and I have never seen bronze flakes before.
 

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The only thing I can think of would be galley plugs or crankcase plugs. I was looking at those flecks, and it would seem to be bearing materials. But it also could be from some part of the scraper rings? No. Those are normally chromed steel. Is there a chance that those flecks are zinc? Very interesting for sure.
 

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When you clean the flakes off is it actually bronze? Typically this is a sign of bearing failure, but the flake it too large to be that. I doubt it's a bearing.
 

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how many miles on the engine? Is this the first time you have removed the strainer?
If the answer to the second question is yes then it could well be manufacturing swarf from when the engine was new.
poorly cleaned cases from the factory.
I would clean the screen and refill with fresh oil and pull it again after 500 klms and recheck.
Any more material would then be a problem.
The only bronze component I can think of in the engine is the r/h side engine cover crank bush.Unlikely to be this though.
If it was a big end failure there would be a whole load of white metal present plus other issues.
Ciao
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Engine has 30 000 km.
Never had strainer out before, but noticed the bronze in the drained oil.
I have since washed the paper from the filter an I have probably 3-400 small fragments of bronze. to go with the big bits from the sump.
I have never seen debris like this in the drained oil or the filter before.
Tonight I will pull the LH side cover and poke a bore scope in through the oil drain holes in the bottom of the crank case for a look.
I thought of the crank bush and the small end bushes, but this is a more copper coloured deposit (leaded bronze) than the more yellowish bronze used in the bushes mentioned.
Anyhow, this much debris cant really go unchecked, just hoping the crankshaft is Ok now. I found a few little bits that are light coloured but mostly bits of gasket sealant. Haven't found anything really white metal like yet.
 

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Engine has 30 000 km.
Never had strainer out before, but noticed the bronze in the drained oil.
I have since washed the paper from the filter an I have probably 3-400 small fragments of bronze. to go with the big bits from the sump.
I have never seen debris like this in the drained oil or the filter before.
Tonight I will pull the LH side cover and poke a bore scope in through the oil drain holes in the bottom of the crank case for a look.
I thought of the crank bush and the small end bushes, but this is a more copper coloured deposit (leaded bronze) than the more yellowish bronze used in the bushes mentioned.
Anyhow, this much debris cant really go unchecked, just hoping the crankshaft is Ok now. I found a few little bits that are light coloured but mostly bits of gasket sealant. Haven't found anything really white metal like yet.

30,000km.....time for a new bike
 

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Thats what I found in the oil of my 848 when I lost my motor. I noticed a clattering and pulled off the track, dropped the oil and found similar (I had more) to what you have there. The engine was still making good power but upon teardown the dealer found the right hand side main bearing had gone along with the big end rod bearings. That material is from the big end rod bearings.

Even though I cought it early (not as early as you though) my rods and crank were junk. Hopefully you're under warranty, good luck with it.
 

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looks like Bearings man. Sorry to hear. Engine is close to toast. I hope you can get warranty.
 

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I got a spare 1098 motor for you mate but unfortunately, shipping it down under would kill the deal :(
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Well, There is some good news.
I now have my engine apart, and definitely the big end bearing on the vertcal cylinder conrod is [email protected]#$%ed. The good news is that I have caught it just in the nic of time. There is but one small scratch on the crankshaft for about 90 degrees of arc. I am confident it will linish out within the allowable pin size limits.
As to why I have a [email protected]#$%ed big end bearing, I am still investigating that.
Any body interested in the grizzly pics, let me know.

So the bill should only be a few bearing shells a few rod bolts gaskets, lock tabs etc.
 

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Well, There is some good news.
I now have my engine apart, and definitely the big end bearing on the vertcal cylinder conrod is [email protected]#$%ed. The good news is that I have caught it just in the nic of time. There is but one small scratch on the crankshaft for about 90 degrees of arc. I am confident it will linish out within the allowable pin size limits.
As to why I have a [email protected]#$%ed big end bearing, I am still investigating that.
Any body interested in the grizzly pics, let me know.

So the bill should only be a few bearing shells a few rod bolts gaskets, lock tabs etc.

Are you doing the work yourself? I think there's only a choice of two bearing sizes from Ducati. And don't forget to buy extra rod bolts. They quickly stretch beyond their limits so you don't get many chances to retorque before they're done.

How many hours once it's all buttoned up again?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Lets see some pics.should be informative.Dont forget to check the crank gallerys and split the oil pump for a look.
ciao
Thanks Phil, Galleries and oil pump, and particulaly relief valve are definitely on the hit list.

Elevens, Yes I am doing the work myself. You are right about the two bearing sizes, there do not seem to be any undersize available, only class marked shells for std production. Bolts on the failed side will be replaced as a matter of course, because even if they are not stretched the fatigue life of the bolts MAY have been impacted by the hammering caused by the increased brg clearance. Only a small chance but cheap insurance.

How many hours till it is buttoned up, don't know, Assembly won't take long, but there is still investigation and measuring to do first, and I have to go overseas for a while this weekend. which will slow things down a lot. Pics to come.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
The pics.

Pics of the shells and crank pin. Upper shell is on the right.
The silvery patch in the middle is the steel shell back. The surrounding bronze is about 0.02mm thick, so probably didn't have a lot of running time left before it got very ugly. The scratch in the crank looks bad in the pic, it does not have a very attractive surface finish but has negligible depth. So I wil linish and remeasure.
 

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A sad business! Those of us with a fair few miles on the clock are watching this with interest.
May I ask what oil you were running, and how frequently you changed it?
520,000 on your other Ducati sounds pretty impressive. What model is it? 169,000 on my old bevel SS looks pretty meagre by comparison..
 

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Thank you for going through the effort of describing and posting the photos your "discovery":cry: Let us know how it turns out.
 
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