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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Let me preface this by saying I only loosely follow the track series. Since I got my 748, Ive read/seen reviews/opinions/videos that the Ducati Superbikes are "hands down" some of the absolute best handling bikes on the track ever built.

And I can feel it. My Duc handles obviously better than my Gixxer ever could.

From the AMA Superbike track racing page, I looked at dozens and dozens of race results over the past few years, and was surprised to see only one or two top 25 Ducati finishes. It seems the dominate forces are all from Yamaha and Suzuki.

So my question...do the rules favor 4 cylinder engines? And if so, is that why there are so few Ducs racing? Seems to me, that if the twins can even come close to the big Japanese rides, they would change the rules.

Or am I simply missing something.

Learn me...
 

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Nice bike.. A friend of mine has an 'ol 748SP..

Interesting topic...
Are you just asking Bout the AMA?
Or are you curious as to the international series' as well?
 

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Actually, Ducati's had a lot of success in the AMA series over the years. They even had a "thunderbike" class which was dominated by Ducati's for a few years. Just a few short years ago, Larry Pegram's only race win's came on a 1198F09. Even in the supersport class, the 848 was on the podium all the time. Back then, Ducati was supporting racing in this country, so teams had access to parts. However, Ducati pulled out of "national" racing, starting with the UK's BSB series and then here in America. The net result was, mostly all of the teams dumping their Ducati's, in favor of other brands; Triumph (supersport) and BMW (superbike).

Now, the only Ducati on the grid, is ridden by a privateer and not someone capable of beating Josh Hayes. I'm sure the bike is excellent as Bolder Motorsport's built it, but without a top rider, its very difficult to succeed.

Unfortunately, if you wish to see Ducati's doing well, you'll have to watch a international series called World Superbike. They have many classes and the superstock 1000 class is dominated by Ducati's. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Nice bike.. A friend of mine has an 'ol 748SP..
Thanks, its in show room condition.

Interesting topic...
Are you just asking Bout the AMA?
Or are you curious as to the international series' as well?
I was indeed talking bout the AMA series, and Tye has chimed in about looking at the International series to see more Ducatis.

Thanks both of you!
 

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I don't want to answer this in public because it will contradict what's been said and only start another argument. Pop me a pm if you want a round up of the story of Ducati racing and especially why little happened in the US as far as results go.
 

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I don't want to answer this in public because it will contradict what's been said and only start another argument. Pop me a pm if you want a round up of the story of Ducati racing and especially why little happened in the US as far as results go.
Interested. Unless you feel like repeating yourself, it may just be best to post it up ;)

Don't give this dude your email, dude is whacko!
He said PM :shrugs:


















:popcorn:

EDIT: What happened to the posts after this? They get deleted?
 

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I don't want to answer this in public because it will contradict what's been said and only start another argument. Pop me a pm if you want a round up of the story of Ducati racing and especially why little happened in the US as far as results go.
1. Nascar took over the AMA.
2. Yoshimura, Suzuki, Matt Mladin cheated for at least 10 years.
3. Ben Spies Yoshimura Suzuki also cheated.
4. Bigger U.S. market for Suzuki and now Yamaha.
5. Enter the Josh Hayes / Yamaha years.
6. No U.S. market value for Ducati.

My evidence of these facts are , look at the "lack of wins / championships" Suzuki & Yamaha had around the world in the other prominent series and you see nothing in comparison to there success in the AMA.

I hate the AMA - not because a lack of Ducati presents but because it's to crooked.

You got me going now. 😠

Ducati......of Corse
 

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A bold claim about Mladin and Yoshimura Suzuki "cheating".

Is this a widely held view? Is it supported by facts?

Not trying to start anything up here - just curious.

I know they dominated the championship for a long while (and I should say I'm no great fan of Mat's) but that is an interesting claim.

Are there others here who see it that way?

:confused:
 

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I just didn't want to start up another argument. I'd actually like that to stop :) But i owe the guys who asked an explanation so i'll post up later. Neo makes some valid points. But also to say Ducati pulled out of national competition racing is incorrect. Apart from the AMA they were never in it. Long explanation needed and I have been busy sorry. I'll follow up later.

let's just say Corse entered AMA believing they could win it hands down. Everything that could be done to stop that, was done.
 

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1. Nascar took over the AMA.
2. Yoshimura, Suzuki, Matt Mladin cheated for at least 10 years.
3. Ben Spies Yoshimura Suzuki also cheated.
4. Bigger U.S. market for Suzuki and now Yamaha.
5. Enter the Josh Hayes / Yamaha years.
6. No U.S. market value for Ducati.

My evidence of these facts are , look at the "lack of wins / championships" Suzuki & Yamaha had around the world in the other prominent series and you see nothing in comparison to there success in the AMA.

I hate the AMA - not because a lack of Ducati presents but because it's to crooked.

You got me going now. 😠

Ducati......of Corse
I'm almost positive that the US is the most profitable contry for Ducati Neo.
 

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But also to say Ducati pulled out of national competition racing is incorrect.
The US only has ONE national professional series. I didn't think anyone would assume I referred to club racing.

Ducati pulled back support from National racing in 2009. This included BSB, AMA, IDM and ASB. The only series which had continued support and still does today is CIV.
 

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and so it begins.
Your statement is incorrect. Ducati Corse never had an official entry in any of those series apart from AMA. All entries in national series were private teams with various levels of support.
That support continues to this day.
 

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1. Nascar took over the AMA.
2. Yoshimura, Suzuki, Matt Mladin cheated for at least 10 years.
3. Ben Spies Yoshimura Suzuki also cheated.
4. Bigger U.S. market for Suzuki and now Yamaha.
5. Enter the Josh Hayes / Yamaha years.
6. No U.S. market value for Ducati.
1. Larry Pegram was on the podium and won a hand-full of races in 2009/2010 on the 1198F09, WAY after the DMG take-over. There was absolutely no reason for Ducati to stop racing in National series. He proved the bike was capable of being on the podium. Put a good rider on it and they might have gone places. Instead, they pulled the plug on the whole program.

2. Suzuki was constantly cheating. The story that everyone knows about, refers to a polished and coated crank in Mladin's bike. Tom Houseworth knew the inspectors were coming, so he went to a local dealer, borrowed a GSXR1000, pulled the crankcases apart, took the crank out and submitted it to inspection. Mladin's crew chief didn't know they were getting inspected and as a consequence, Mladin lost something around 50 points (whole weekend discounted). Thats just one of many incidents and how Ben Spies won the championship that year.

3. Suzuki is by far the lowest selling of the Japanese brands.

5. The Yamaha could be (as in perhaps/maybe/NOT FACT) considered a cheater bike as well. Get up good and close, you will see the frame has an FIM World Superbike number plate on it. Yes, the motor is legit, but they out-spend everyone else on electronics and development. The bike was so good, his first race wins against Mladin were made without traction control. Josh Hayes only won because Ben Spies and Mat Mladin stopped racing.

6. The US is Ducati's number one SINGLE market.

My evidence of these facts are , look at the "lack of wins / championships" Suzuki & Yamaha had around the world in the other prominent series and you see nothing in comparison to there success in the AMA.
IDK what series you've been watching, but in World Superbike, the Suzuki and Yamaha have been very dominant for many years. Remember the Haga/Bayliss battle in WSBK 2007/2008? Remember Troy Corser winning a WSBK title in 2005 on a Suzuki? However, Josh Hayes, Ben Spies and Mat Mladin were the best RIDERS and as a consequence, they won. Its a coincidence they happen to be on those particular brands winning. Ducati use to win in World Superbikes in dominant fashion as well.

I hate the AMA - not because a lack of Ducati presents but because it's to crooked.
Its the worst. Being demoted to a club race series, that kinda put the nail in the coffin.
 

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Ducati Corse never had an official entry in any of those series apart from AMA. All entries in national series were private teams with various levels of support.
Thats correct, it was all National supported racing. British Superbikes supported by Ducati UK, ASB supported by Ducati Australia, etc. Point is… they decided to pull out.
 

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Tye, why did you skip from 3 to 5??
 
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Thats correct, it was all National supported racing. British Superbikes supported by Ducati UK, ASB supported by Ducati Australia, etc. Point is… they decided to pull out.
They didn't pull out. They never had an entry in it. in 2009 there was an issue finding a team to use and manage the level of support Ducati UK were willing to offer and Tim Macabee made a statement at that time ( he's my friend you might recall, my sister's boss. I mention this so you don't think I'm talking out of my hat ). if it was a Ducati corse entry they would not have been looking for a team.
Jessop's riders team took that on the year after, then moto rapido who later merged into rapido sport racing and now Millsport Ducati.
Ducati continued to support all of those teams. Corse sent over engineers season long, Ernesto himself shows up to a few rounds every year. Matteo Baiocco raced last year paid for by Ducati but he raced in a private team and is now in CIV for a year as per his deal. Jacob Smrz is at Millsport because of Ducati.
Ducati are supporting the 3C-Racing Team, which will be taking part in this year’s IDM International German Superbike Championshi. That's technical support and two Corse technicians.

Ducati continue to support private teams with varying levels of support. They don't have an official entry.

The airwaves Ducati team of 2008 was about as close you could get to a Ducati entry in BSB. But it wasn't factory. Ducati do WSBK and MotoGP ( and they didn't particularly want to do the latter ) The AMA was a factory effort for commercial reasons and I'll be discussing that with others in a separate post.
There is a difference between Ducati running a team and a private team running on a Ducati.

Please don't tell me that what is going on in my back yard with people I happen to know very well is somehow a figment of my imagination. That's just rude. If I want to hire a clown to contradict my every word I'll be in touch. Until then I'd prefer that you did not converse with me at all. Your past transgressions are not forgiven. I'm not here to chat with you like pals.
 

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Folks close to Larry Pegram, Foremost Racing, know that the support from Ducati was very minimal. Which is one of the reasons they switched to BMW. When that didn't work out they switched to Yamaha, then to EBR,..... pretty much a privateer effort.
 
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