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Electrical issues? Upgrade your 1X98/848 Voltage Regulator.

46K views 38 replies 16 participants last post by  Tchase 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
If you are not a member, you can contact me at fiftymilchannel@gmail.com

List of Parts:
Triumph Harness T2500676 (affiliated link: https://goo.gl/dYFcy4)
FH020 Regulator (Anywhere on eBay, or from a reputable store: https://goo.gl/DsxN7m)




If you have owned a 1x98/848 long enough, or any bike long enough, one of the most common parts to fail first is the voltage regulator.




Cause of Failure:
1) Usually, but not always, regulators especially ones with older designs like the ones on the 1x98/848 overheat. The circuitry melts and can not function properly.

Why the regulator overheats:
1) Sitting in traffic (Ducati issued a recall and provided a band-aid solution for these bikes in terms of a metal shield from the heat)
2) The power generated by the stator is not being used up and the VR has to work harder to get rid of it (for example: Switching incandescent bulbs for LED ones that consume less power, switching off your headlights, etc.

Symptoms of a failing voltage regulator include:
1) High (>14.8V) or Low (<13.0V) charging voltage when the engine is running
2) Flickering dashboard screen/instrument panel
3) Dashboard shuts off at certain RPMs
3) Dead battery that was otherwise new/healthy
4) Headlights/Tailight shutting off randomly at certain RPMs

Detailed Background (adapted from DEcosse on triumphrat.net)
MOSFET R/R are a great reliability improvement on the OEM SCR type R/R, in its own right as the R/R device. However, they do nothing to add reliability to the stator, whereas the Series Style greatly enhances this aspect. A Series R/R significantly reduces the load on the stator which will run close to half of the current as it would with a Shunt R/R (whether that be SCR or MOSFET) Ergo the stator runs less hot and reliability is significantly improved.


This mod applies equally to most modern bikes regardless of the marque/model. The defining factor regardless of motorcycle brand/year/model is that your bike has the discreet 3-phase Stator/Generator and Rectifier/Regulator arrangement

As a preliminary, acknowledgements due to OldnDumb and CLB for their previous inputs on this subject.

This is about replacing the standard equipment Regulator/Rectifier with a more efficient component. You can do this in event of failure rather than replace it with the same stock component, or you can even do it as a preventive measure if desired.

As a prologue, let me introduce a basic troubleshooting process to determine whether you have a charging system failure.

Diagnostics:
A good Multi-meter is a pre-requisite.
Record your battery voltage under the following conditions
1) Ignition off, unloaded battery.
2) Ignition on, headlights on, not running
3) Bike started, running at idle

For condition 1, should be at least in the high 12. x range if fully charged.

In condition 2, your voltage should not drop much below 12.0 at worst. (It may continue to drop — hopefully slowly! — as your lights will be discharging it. However, this should be a slow decline)
If it does drop immediately into the 11’s, your battery is insufficiently charged — if it was just charged from a battery charger however, then it indicates your battery no longer has sufficient capacity to retain charge/supply current to load and should be replaced.

Condition 3 is what we are most interested in with respect to charging capability.
Voltage should be at least in the 13s at all engine rpm. You may detect it will fall off slightly as you raise the engine rpm. This is not an atypical performance. A simple mod that can enhance your charging voltage to the battery can be achieved by this modification outlined in this thread. That should give you performance in the 14V+ range.

What if you have less than 13V?
The first thing to check is the fuse in the charging circuit. Ask on the forum for your particular model which one you should check if in doubt.

Next, examine the wires and connectors between the stator output and the R/R input (three wire harnesses and connectors) — are these charred/melted due to excessive heating? This is a fairly common result of poor connection between the mating terminals. See later in the thread for examples of this issue & suggested replacements.

A ‘cold’ resistance check for shorted diode/SCR:
Unplug both input & output plugs from R/R;
With your meter set to read resistance (use a diode test if your multi-meter has one), test from each pin of the three-pin plug, to both the red & black wired pins of the 4-pin plug; NONE of these should read short circuit (zero resistance); depending which way you bias the test leads, you may get some reading (from the forward bias of the component) but it must absolutely not be short. If you see a short on any of these readings the R/R is defective.

Next, do a resistance check on the stator (check at the cable connector going back towards the stator itself). This test is typically unlikely to show any definitive issue, whether good or bad - unless there is a completely open circuit to one pin, perhaps indicating a broken wire connection
Some guides suggest you can see a difference between the readings if there is a burned coil - highly unlikely that you have a meter that is capable of differentiating.
So really just looking for basic continuity here.
Measure between the three respective combinations of the three pins:
1-2
2-3
3-1

This time each of these should measure almost short circuit (very low resistance in order or about 1 ohm)

This next check is probably the simplest/quickest way of determining a stator problem
- in the majority of cases a bad stator will be indicated by failing the following test:
Check resistance from anyone pin to the engine ground terminal — this should not read any indication — maximum resistance or open-circuit.
If you read ‘short’ in that last test, then your stator is bad.
(if open, it is not quite guaranteed your stator is good, however - but in the majority of cases a failed stator will fail this isolation test)

Check the AC voltage output from the stator with the engine running:
Leave the stator disconnected from the R/R and start the engines.
With the meter set to read AC Volts check
1-2
2-3
3-1
All three should be the same value — any significant difference of one reading will indicate a bad phase and the stator is probably defective.
At idle this should be ~ 20V* and rise to ~ 70V* at 5K rpm.
I hesitate to use absolute numbers here as this can be different between models and test equipment and especially the engine rpm!
What you are looking for is some value between phases and like increase on each phase as rpm increases.
If any of the above tests raises suspicion, pull the cover & inspect the stator. It is simple to do and can set your mind at ease by seeing what it looks like. Hopefully NOT with 1/3 of it a black charred mess!

If you have to replace the stator and R/R, especially because of a shorted R/R and excess current drain, be especially careful to ensure that your wiring has not been compromised. Replace any cable &/or connector plug that is not in optimum condition.


Now on to the alternative R/R replacement

Preface: When this thread wrote, there really wasn't a good Series Regulator widely available as a replacement candidate. Now there are a couple of options that are in play.
This thread is read by many non-Triumph owners so I will define the replacement strategy into two groups

1: If your bike marque/model generally has a robust stator with a low failure rate amongst the population, then MOSFET Regulator remains a good reliability improvement for high-failure SCR Shunt Regulators.

2. If your bike marque/model suffers from a relatively high failure rate in the general population, then MOSFET Regulator will do NOTHING to improve this situation and the selection of a Series* style Regulator becomes a much better choice.

* The short version is that a Series Regulator will run a much lower current in the stator and so it will have the stator itself producing lower dissipated power, run cooler and be more reliable.
Generally, a much better device regarding the reliability of the stator. The only downside - until recently - has been cost vs good value MOSFET Shunt units. However, that 'value' is achieved if stator replacement does not have to be added to the equation!

For more on Series Regulators read on down towards the bottom of the thread.

MOSFET SHUNT REGULATORS

Best widely available MOSFET Shunt R/R on the market today is the Shindengen FH012AA (and superceded by the FH020AA) used on the late (06+) Yamaha FJR, 07+ Yamaha R1 among others
What makes it better is that is a MOSFET-controlled device rather than the crude SCR shunt type that is on most bikes until recently and also is a 50A-rated device.
MUCH better voltage regulation and runs cooler too due to more efficient devices and control circuitry.
* Recently superseded by FH020

The SCR shunt type consumes more energy in the Regulator itself than the bike is using and dumps a ton of current into the heatsink (feel yours & just see how hot those things run!!!! - don't touch it - you'll burn yourself - seriously!) The problem is exacerbated because their efficiency goes even lower when they get HOT so it's a vicious circle. Heat is the number 1 killer of these devices.
Incidentally, it's a misconception that shunt type work harder with increased load i.e. higher-wattage lights, heated vests etc - actually, the higher the load on the output, the less work the shunt regulator does in dumping that excess energy and will actually run cooler!!

The FET has extremely low resistance in conducting state and this results in a lower dissipated power from the device while conducting load current, as opposed to the SCR which shunts the maximum current across a significant volt drop, resulting in a higher dissipated power - and resulting temperature, much more so than the FET device.



The Solution

When your regulator fails or is about to fail, you have two options. Replace it with the same one or retrofit a newer model.



I chose the latter by upgrading mine to the newer Shindengen MOSFET FH020 used by nearly all bikes in the market currently (R1, S1000RR, Panigale, etc.). A quick search on the internet will reveal that the earlier model FH012 is commonly used too. The FH020 is the newer and updated model of that.

The Ducati Panigale FH020 part number is: 540.4.030.1B


Retrofitting a slightly larger and completely different type of voltage regulator to your bike might seem like a daunting task. There are two things you need to do in order for it to work:
1) Wiring (T2500676)
2) Mounting

Wiring
Fortunately for us, Triumph has already taken care of item number 1 during the recall on their bikes when they also retrofitted their bikes with an updated regulator. In their recall, they provided a small plug-n-play harness to make the entire retrofit job easier without any soldering/splicing. This harness is readily available at all Triumph dealerships for $10 and change (cheaper than sourcing just the plugs out yourself!) The part number is: T2500676


Mounting
Mounting the larger and newer regulator requires a little custom work. You could easily mount the new regulator by fabricating an adapter bracket out of aluminium from your local hardware store.




However, I decided to go a bit further and make a permanent solution in the form of a CNC-cut carbon fibre bracket.



Carbon fibre offers a couple of advantages - stronger, lighter and more importantly it shields heat better than metal. All of which ensures the new voltage regulator is further protected from the heat radiating from the header/engine.


With all that done, it was as simple as tightening everything down and you’re done.



Of course, I can't leave anything alone so I ceramic-coated the metal heat shield as well. Hope that helps!





Disclaimer:
VJ020 cannot guarantee against improper use or unauthorized modifications of this information. VJ020 assumes no liability for damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this thread. Use this information at your own risk. VJ020 recommends safe practices when working on vehicles and or with tools. No information contained in this video shall create any expressed or implied warranty or guarantee of any particular result. Any injury, damage, or loss that may result from improper use of these tools, equipment, or from the information contained in this video is the sole responsibility of the user and not VJ020.
 
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#3 · (Edited)
That was an excellent write-up, and I'm second in line as a customer for a carbon bracket.

I own an S4RS, so the bracket is probably different from an 1X98, but I'd be happy to take what you have and adapt it.

If you could punch out a "generic" CF bracket with big holes for lightness :) and mounting holes to accommodate the aforementioned R/R... for say $20-ish...
Let the buyer drill for frame mounting and supply the clamps or ty-wraps...) I bet you'd sell a bunch of them. I have six bikes and all but the S1000RR and the 675 would likely benefit from this.
One at a time, with the Ducati up first, and the Cagiva second. I've felt the temp of the Ducati's RR through the seat on a hot day. Thought it would melt through the seat.

(Note to self...start scouring eBay for spare S1000RR and Triumph R/Rs...)

Subscribing, and hoping...

Thanks again, Rich in TX
 
#8 · (Edited)
That was an excellent write-up...
Thanks for the kind words!
The carbon fiber is pricey but they do offer significant heat shielding from the headers as I have found when I took readings of temperature before and after the carbon fiber bracket was installed and the engine idling away at 95 degrees celsius (without a belly pan).
 
#5 ·
Thank you for posting this.
I ordered the Triumph wiring harness last week, arrived this week.
Bought a MOSFET R/R on eBay, arrived today.
Looking forward to installing all tomorrow on the S4RS.

...And then buying another of each for my Cagiva Gran Canyon (ST2 engine/electrics).
 
#6 ·
I am so sorry guys I didn't know photobucket updated their policy and pulled off all the photos unless I paid for their subscription. Regardless, all is fixed now!

Also sorry for not checking in on this thread. First and second batch orders have been completed for members who pm'd me earlier. Private message me if you would like to make a custom bracket with specific dimensions or if you would like one for your 1X98/848. Thanks!
 
#9 ·
Thanks again.

For S4R/S4RS (and probably other Monster) owners:
I mounted the eBay BMW S1000RR MOSFET RR and the Triumph wiring harness yesterday. Functionally, works perfectly--13.9 VDC. And runs cool.

With the wiring connectors pointing aft and the RR bolted to the original frame mount (with the RH bolt only) the seat will not drop into position. Arghhh...

Either have to cut away at the front of the paperwork/toolkit box under the seat or find another mounting spot for the RR.

Third option is to fit a Sargent seat (fortunately, I just happen to have one...)

Already bought another BMW MOSFET RR on eBay and and ordered another Triumph harness for the Gran Canyon. That will require some wiring mods...hope to have the parts to take that on this weekend.
 
#13 · (Edited)
That's brilliant! The FH020 generates a lot less heat into the fins as they work via a different principle.

I thought about doing it the same as you but was just a bit worried about adding extra wires to the already weak charging system and also wanted to keep the weight down low. But looks like it's working well. Well done!
 
#15 · (Edited)
It's a shunt style, same as the ones being used on panigale.

If you have unlimited budget I strongly recommend upgrading to the newest SH847 series style regulator. Since they are a serial type instead of shunting excess current, they can shut off the stator when there is excess current reducing heat/load on the stator (improving longevity) and free up lost horsepower.

It is not without cons, however. It is about double the price of a FH020 and significantly larger and heavier. Fitment might be a problem and there has been no proven results on them yet as they are designed for cruiser bikes in mind. They have not been tested on sport bikes yet (with the significantly higher RPM ranges). Previously the SH775 predecessor of the 847 were fitted on sport bikes and the higher RPMs destroyed them.


The primary reason why sport bikes like S1000RR, R1 and Panigales haven't adopted 847 in my opinion is because of its sheer size, the smaller battery/less electrical accessories often fitted to sport bikes, and sport bikes often ridden at higher speeds (so heat is less of an issue)
 
#16 · (Edited)
Thank you.
After re-reading the article I think I'm correct in saying this mod helps with R/R reliability but does not really help with the stator.
To help stator reliability we need a series R/R which this mod is not.
Are the stators in the 1*98 a problem as far as reliability goes?
I don't think I've seen/read them to be a problem?
 
#17 ·
Correct. My research indicates rare occurences of 1x98/848 stator failure. Failures often result from corroded/burnt wiring from the stator or the stator itself, such as the aprilia RSV4. In that department, our 1x98/848 stators seem to be built relatively robust.

In contrast, there are a lot more occurrences of the regulator failing on 1x98/848, myself including. I associate this to the old-fashioned and poorly designed regulator chosen for our bikes. Putting it beside the exhaust header and idling away in rush hour traffic certainly makes the matter worse!

If you're concerned about the stator reliability, I would strongly recommend the series SH847 regulator, but no research on that has been documented so far.
 
#18 ·
Great thread, thanks for taking the time to do the write up.

Quick few questions:

1. Does the Triumph wiring require any modification?
2. Are you still making the carbon bracket?
3. Where did you buy your VR & Wiring from? I see there has been a few reports of fake VR's on ebay etc..

Thanks in advance.
 
#20 ·
There is only one "aftermarket" source of the Shendengen MOSFET RR- both the FH and SH series. I use roadstercycle dot com.
You can also get these things from a Polaris dealer, a Yamaha dealer, or a Ducati dealer if you can find the correct part number.

The best possible thing to do here is to buy the 847 version, and relocate it to the right side of the engine. Ive posted pics of how I did this in the 999 forum, but I did the same thing to my 1098.
 
#19 ·
1. Optional - As is, the Triumph wire plugs directly into the new voltage regulator and the OEM harness without any issues - plug n play. However, the OCD in me went one step further and swapped the oem connector from the old VR over to the triumph wire. This lets me use the additional clip that locks the two connectors together. Others have worked around this by using zip ties to securely fasten the mating connectors together and some have just left it as-is. There has been no reports of issues by users who left it as is.

2. Yes! Contact me via email (fiftymilchannel@gmail.com) or private message if you need a bracket also.

3. I bought my VR from a Ducati 1299S that was parted out and the triumph harness directly from the local Triumph dealer here. The fake VR's you mention come from China and has been well documented to fail prematurely (ie. less than a year to two years). Although I can't guarantee 100% my VR is authentic as I did not personally remove the VR from the panigale, inspection of the quality of the VR and the presence of the ducati part number found on the VR would suggest it's authentic. Another good sign of authenticity is the quality and build of the plastic plugs. The plastic should feel robust and click together positively. Often times, fake VRs are made with cheap plastic plugs that look dehydrated and prone to cracking. When you push the connectors together they often feel weak and will certainly wiggle around even after connected.
 
#23 ·
Thanks for the Write up @VJ020, i which i saw it last year wen i replace my first VR wen i had the lights and dash powering off on my Ducati, i had an extra used OEM VR and replace it but now its starting again, just order the SHINDENGEN FH020AA VR and the TRIUPH Harnes to replace the trash OEM VR, hope this takes care for good the issue... Thanks Again
 
#25 ·
Hiya everyone, newbie here to the forum.

I have a question for VJ020. I've just purchased a second hand Ducati Streetfighter 848 and the batt voltage on the dash is flashing at 11.9 Volts. I've decided to take your advice after reading this forum and are replacing the R/R with the following Mosfet R/R:

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Mosfet-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

My question is this. Do I need to also purchase the Triumph Wiring Harness that you mention as my R/R is mounted up the rear end of my Streetfighter under the battery and not on the right hand side of the engine as per your photos?

Many thanks in advance for your help.
 
#27 ·
Bump and big thumbs up for lots of great info! I'm just installing a SH 847 in my 1098. I had a FH 020 that I installed when the original crapped out a few years ago. The wiring at the RR was just about to fail! Crispy and brown... Mosfet helps but if you reduce the power usage (LED, no lights for track days, high tech batteries, and so on) then the power has to be converted to heat and that does damage. Hoping the SH 847 delivers!
 
#30 ·
I am going to order one of these to test, but I do already have a bias here: namely, the Shindengen stuff is going to be better quality, and is much less expensive.
The Rick's part is $165.

They are claiming that charge point is 14.2v, which would indeed be great for a lithium battery.
They do not mention what the current output is- the FH020 is a 50amp part.
The Shindengen stuff charges at 14, and Ive seen as much as 14.4 when the battery is fully charged after a long ride.

On the BMW's, this same FH020 charges at 14.5, as the stator output is much higher.

I'll be interested to hear how this works.
 
#33 ·
Would like to add an unreserved recommendation for customer service at Rick's. Rapid response to emails, and a one day turnaround on a request to manufacture an adaptor plate for my 1098 to allow mounting in the original location. I literally sent the layout one day, and it was in the mail the next. Installation was straightforward, if a little tight, and seems to have solved my charging issues.
 

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