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Court Jester
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Discussion Starter #1
They couldn't wait for Lorenzo to leave :)
 

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Court Jester
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Discussion Starter #4
Alex will be crushed on track like all the others by Marc.
A lot of folks are saying this.

I’m going to go out on a limb and say he’s going to be just like his brother. Mark hasn’t changed all that much, yes he is a better rider but still pulls dick moves all the time.

His brother has the same father, the same drive, the same head start, I think Alex will be successful over time and lots of crashes like his big brother.

We might even get a side benefit of sibling rivalry letting other riders take advantage.
 

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A lot of folks are saying this.

I’m going to go out on a limb and say he’s going to be just like his brother. Mark hasn’t changed all that much, yes he is a better rider but still pulls dick moves all the time.

His brother has the same father, the same drive, the same head start, I think Alex will be successful over time and lots of crashes like his big brother.

We might even get a side benefit of sibling rivalry letting other riders take advantage.
The only way I think Alex becomes Moto GP champ is to not race against Marc. Fabio, Rins, & Maverick will be Marcs chief competition for at least the next 5 years. Honda was able to get DORNA to change the rules to allow Marc to come from Moto 2 to a factory ride. That was not allowed before Marc, you would have to go from Moto 2 to a satellite ride first. Alex will probably win races, but it won't be easy. He's not a Vale, Marc, Wayne, Wayne, (yes 2 Waynes) Mick, Kevin, Jorge. As long as Marc stays healthy he will stay dominant for at least the next five years, Rins and Suzuki will improve and be a threat, same with Fabio & Maverick with Yamaha. Ducati could really use Jorge to be partnered with Jack Miller on the factory squad. I think Franco Morbideli is one to watch. I think Marc will let Alex see his data and give him advice but at the end of the day Alex will still have to ride the bike on his own and I don't see Marc giving anyone a win.
 

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Court Jester
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Discussion Starter #6
The only way I think Alex becomes Moto GP champ is to not race against Marc. Fabio, Rins, & Maverick will be Marcs chief competition for at least the next 5 years. Honda was able to get DORNA to change the rules to allow Marc to come from Moto 2 to a factory ride. That was not allowed before Marc, you would have to go from Moto 2 to a satellite ride first. Alex will probably win races, but it won't be easy. He's not a Vale, Marc, Wayne, Wayne, (yes 2 Waynes) Mick, Kevin, Jorge. As long as Marc stays healthy he will stay dominant for at least the next five years, Rins and Suzuki will improve and be a threat, same with Fabio & Maverick with Yamaha. Ducati could really use Jorge to be partnered with Jack Miller on the factory squad. I think Franco Morbideli is one to watch. I think Marc will let Alex see his data and give him advice but at the end of the day Alex will still have to ride the bike on his own and I don't see Marc giving anyone a win.
Family mind games is going to be a big factor.
 

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I am not sure how the MotoGP season will play out this year but this thread gets 100% for the talking points raised!!! I am guessing Marc may have another winning season but the civil rivalry between he and his brother could be epic - in a good way....I am still a Rossi fan hoping Yamaha can find more power in the future....will see...

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Court Jester
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Discussion Starter #8
I am not sure how the MotoGP season will play out this year but this thread gets 100% for the talking points raised!!! I am guessing Marc may have another winning season but the civil rivalry between he and his brother could be epic - in a good way....I am still a Rossi fan hoping Yamaha can find more power in the future....will see...

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Pretty much how I feel.

Honestly I don’t care who wins if it’s between a good race or a boring race. Yes I’m going to root Dovi and always want to see Ducati competitive in its unique way always thinking outside the box and also relying on its heritage.

If having two brothers on the track at the same time changes the dynamics enough to make for a more competitive race I’m all for it. Let’s face it while Marc is crazy skilled ( and a bit of a bully) it made for a overall boring year, there were a few great races this year, but having the championship won so soon it was anticlimactic.

Alex might never be a champion like his brother but I got to believe Marc will elevate Alex’s performance. Might go the other way, it’s already got me anxious.
 

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I couldn't agree more...boring for most of the races. If one team dominates with the motorcycle and rider then the actual race is mute. Moto 2 and 3 have proven to be more competitive. Let's hope Ducati, Yamaha, KTM, and Suzuki can field more competitive bikes so at least other Challenger's have a chance to win... Watching Rossi lead a race, or others, only to lose every time on the straightaway was just sad. If he had a competitive motorcycle perhaps he could at least get a few podiums along with others.

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A bit harsh in my view to say the racing this year was boring, although it's certainly true that the smaller classes put on an amazing year, which perhaps tended to make the MotoGP class seem a bit less thrilling by comparison.
But there were so many stellar moments, particularly with the new blood; Fabio in particular of course. A lot more to come from that 'quarter'. ;)
As for Alex's chances in the top class? He appears a bit more fragile when interviewed - more introspective than Marc perhaps. He is definitely a different breed to his brother. But the way he took charge of the Moto2 class this year, his classic save, his understated mannerism - I would allow for the possibility of his reaching the heights.
I remember their dad saying a few years back that Alex was actually the quicker of the two at times when they were growing up, presumably allowing for their age difference at that time. And he would have a better idea than the rest of us.
But of course Marc has many years of head start in the bigger class, so Alex will need a year or two before we can expect wonders.
But the relative power/acceleration of the various makes is a real area of interest. It seems to me that the different makes are somewhat locked into their current engine architecture, and that their various attributes - relative to one another - will remain in roughly the same order. I see this as reflective of their various engineering solutions.
The engines that don't require any (or as much) counterbalancing - Honda and Ducati - have an advantage in power, offset by the benefit of the more compact engine mass of the in-line solution of Yamaha, and now Suzuki. Mass centralisation at the price of more rotating mass internally.
Of the least counterbalanced engines the Ducati has the advantage of Desmo valve operation, allowing more radical opening and closing of the valves. IE - the valves can be open wider, and for longer, in a way valve springs can't allow. That places it as potentially the most powerful engine, within the strict limitations of maximum bore size/number of cylinders mandated by MotoGP.
Their offset between the two 'Vs' appears to give them other advantages in traction and tyre use, so they have two significant design advantages over the other makes. But they still suffer from a 'mid corner problem', which masks these other advantages, but are clearly the most powerful down the longer straights. But they don't have a Marquez in the saddle.
The Honda is the closest behind Ducati in theoretical output, as a 'conventional' 90 degree V4 without the need for counterbalancing, and this appears to remain the case, in spite of their power increase this year. It too remains difficult to ride at various points, as demonstrated by Crutchlow's unhappiness, and perhaps Lorenzo's lacklustre performances on it (although with Jorgé and his various injuries it is difficult to take much from that)!
Suzuki have obviously made serious power and tyre preservation gains, with Mir showing signs of serious competitiveness along with of course Rins. Some of Rins' less polite manoeuvres have counted against him during the year, and limited Suzuki's success, but I would expect Suzuki to continue to creep towards the front, with their now-expected surge late in the race on tyres that seem to last better for them.
Yamaha? Too reliant on the mercurial talent of Fabio in my view for their success, although it has to be said that he may be bringing out the best in Vinales, who now appears to be getting a bike set up purely for him, after having a bike (ostensibly) biased towards Valé's preference for some time.
KTM reputedly have serious power output, if a somewhat unruly bike to ride, but the combination of Pol Espargaro, Binder and another year's development could see them appearing closer to the front more often, at least later next year. Just not with Zarco on it...
Leaving only Aprilia, who continue improving, only to be outclassed by greater improvements in the other makes. They can't seem to quite catch up to the moving target that the larger factories present. Or Ducati, who are hardly a 'larger factory', yet continue to 'punch above their weight' regardless.
And we love that! Bring on next year, quick.

:D
 

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Court Jester
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Discussion Starter #13
A bit harsh in my view to say the racing this year was boring, although it's certainly true that the smaller classes put on an amazing year, which perhaps tended to make the MotoGP class seem a bit less thrilling by comparison.
But there were so many stellar moments, particularly with the new blood; Fabio in particular of course. A lot more to come from that 'quarter'. ;)
As for Alex's chances in the top class? He appears a bit more fragile when interviewed - more introspective than Marc perhaps. He is definitely a different breed to his brother. But the way he took charge of the Moto2 class this year, his classic save, his understated mannerism - I would allow for the possibility of his reaching the heights.
I remember their dad saying a few years back that Alex was actually the quicker of the two at times when they were growing up, presumably allowing for their age difference at that time. And he would have a better idea than the rest of us.
But of course Marc has many years of head start in the bigger class, so Alex will need a year or two before we can expect wonders.
But the relative power/acceleration of the various makes is a real area of interest. It seems to me that the different makes are somewhat locked into their current engine architecture, and that their various attributes - relative to one another - will remain in roughly the same order. I see this as reflective of their various engineering solutions.
The engines that don't require any (or as much) counterbalancing - Honda and Ducati - have an advantage in power, offset by the benefit of the more compact engine mass of the in-line solution of Yamaha, and now Suzuki. Mass centralisation at the price of more rotating mass internally.
Of the least counterbalanced engines the Ducati has the advantage of Desmo valve operation, allowing more radical opening and closing of the valves. IE - the valves can be open wider, and for longer, in a way valve springs can't allow. That places it as potentially the most powerful engine, within the strict limitations of maximum bore size/number of cylinders mandated by MotoGP.
Their offset between the two 'Vs' appears to give them other advantages in traction and tyre use, so they have two significant design advantages over the other makes. But they still suffer from a 'mid corner problem', which masks these other advantages, but are clearly the most powerful down the longer straights. But they don't have a Marquez in the saddle.
The Honda is the closest behind Ducati in theoretical output, as a 'conventional' 90 degree V4 without the need for counterbalancing, and this appears to remain the case, in spite of their power increase this year. It too remains difficult to ride at various points, as demonstrated by Crutchlow's unhappiness, and perhaps Lorenzo's lacklustre performances on it (although with Jorgé and his various injuries it is difficult to take much from that)!
Suzuki have obviously made serious power and tyre preservation gains, with Mir showing signs of serious competitiveness along with of course Rins. Some of Rins' less polite manoeuvres have counted against him during the year, and limited Suzuki's success, but I would expect Suzuki to continue to creep towards the front, with their now-expected surge late in the race on tyres that seem to last better for them.
Yamaha? Too reliant on the mercurial talent of Fabio in my view for their success, although it has to be said that he may be bringing out the best in Vinales, who now appears to be getting a bike set up purely for him, after having a bike (ostensibly) biased towards Valé's preference for some time.
KTM reputedly have serious power output, if a somewhat unruly bike to ride, but the combination of Pol Espargaro, Binder and another year's development could see them appearing closer to the front more often, at least later next year. Just not with Zarco on it...
Leaving only Aprilia, who continue improving, only to be outclassed by greater improvements in the other makes. They can't seem to quite catch up to the moving target that the larger factories present. Or Ducati, who are hardly a 'larger factory', yet continue to 'punch above their weight' regardless.
And we love that! Bring on next year, quick.

:D
Absolutely there were “moments”, one too many races were over after the first few laps, and the championship was won how many races prior to the last? When the title is won so early yes it can make for some boring races. Great to see Fabio coming and at least my wife got to hear a different name other than Marc Marquez... I don’t really watch moto 2&3 so I’m strictly griping about GP. It’s also hard to see Rossi struggle and I think it has more to do with age than machine. One take away from the year for me is Marquez can be beat, but you have to be consistent, I have to wonder if Lorenzo didn’t race this year would Dovi had a chance. Dovi is like a magnet when others screw up :(

Remember Pat I’m bias for Ducati :) so yes if we are not winning I can be a bit harsh lol.
 

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I watched every Moto GP Q1, Q2, and race. I thoroughly enjoyed every one of them, I'm not a Marquez fan (I respect how good he is, but think he's a douche) still a Rossi fan and believe he most likely wont win again (he still runs better than a lot of guys). I like to see all the different angles, slow mo's, close ups and every little bit they show. I watch as much of the Moto 2&3 races and qualifying as I can make time for.
 

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Court Jester
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Discussion Starter #15
I watched every Moto GP Q1, Q2, and race. I thoroughly enjoyed every one of them, I'm not a Marquez fan (I respect how good he is, but think he's a douche) still a Rossi fan and believe he most likely wont win again (he still runs better than a lot of guys). I like to see all the different angles, slow mo's, close ups and every little bit they show. I watch as much of the Moto 2&3 races and qualifying as I can make time for.
Well I didn’t realize we were adding qualifying, yes those were as entertaining as some races.

I resubbed if I wasn’t entertained I wouldn’t of, there is plenty of entertainment. I’m talking the competitiveness, it’s why I enjoy football over baseball. The NFL has worked hard to hold a balance, yes you get the occasional “Patriots” however within any given game or match up it’s any given Sunday. In MotoGP in any given Sunday you are basically hoping Marquez goes down (with getting hurt) or has a mechanical. It’s almost as if he should be handicapped to the rear of the line up, he’d still probably win. This is the “boring factor for me.

As for individual riders I’m more a factory fan than a rider, but respect the shit out of the riders. Marquez needs to go to Ducati!
 

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I get that about Marquez taking some of the excitement out of it - that if he finishes he's almost bound to win. But I take some enjoyment just from his insane ability on the bike, even though he's almost in a different class.
I too watch almost every second of practice and qualifying (as well as every race, slo-mos etc) which is where the relative closeness of Moto2 and 3 can make MotoGP seem a bit lacking in the four-bikes-wide corner entry stakes.
But there were some excellent races. Whether you want Ducati to win, Rossi to win, an underdog make to improve (or an Aussie to find success!) there was something for everybody. The camera technology continues to improve, with more and more technology applied to showing us more and more detail.
And news overnight that Zarco will be riding a Ducati, presumably getting Abraham's ride, although the riders have been unhappy in that team, precipitating Abraham's departure, so Zarco may not last the whole year if that continues.
But, as we say here: "when too much motorcycle racing is barely enough" - borrowed from legendary 'sport comedians' Roy and HG. (Worth looking up if you don't know their work).
Nice to visit this place again after some time, and good to see T-Chase holding his own. You have become something of a 'blogger' over the years mate! Your writing has improved out of sight, and your balanced approach still refreshing. Good work.
So yes, Marquez' (M's!) superiority will undoubtedly be a factor in the closeness of the racing next year again, but there are a number of riders getting closer. Vinales, Quartararo and Morbidelli for example, if the Yamaha can be improved in the off-season.
The bikes may improve to varying degrees in their 2020 form, and some riders (eg Miller) will be on higher level machinery. Plenty to look forward to, and I guess to some degree we should rejoice in Marc's talent, as we did when Rossi was dominant for all those years.
But the 'playing field' is more level since those days, making Marc's achievements all the more admirable, so let's bear that in mind. And he IS human, as he reminds us every now and then with some pretty ordinary 'offs'.
Next year won't be all his way, even though he remains the favourite in betting terms. We may see a bit more of the fragility that we glimpsed occasionally as Fabio continues to treat him like 'just another rider'. No room for prima donnas out there next year. It will be all in, and Marc may not be as dominant as he has been.
 

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When I first seen that the Marquez brothers were team mates my first thought was ..."thats not gonna be good for them or Honda". I could be wrong, but if I had to race along side my brother it would take away my concentration on the rest of the field.
We'll see.
:popcorn:
 

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Court Jester
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Discussion Starter #18
When I first seen that the Marquez brothers were team mates my first thought was ..."thats not gonna be good for them or Honda". I could be wrong, but if I had to race along side my brother it would take away my concentration on the rest of the field.
We'll see.
:popcorn:
Yep if anything it should add some type of drama... But Marc isn't 100% either..
 
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