Ducati.org forum banner

1 - 20 of 156 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I have taken some pics, and will tell the story of the rebuild in this thread when I get time.

In the meantime, I just got a quote for replacement piston rings. Would you believe they want to charge us over $500 for rings over here, PER PISTON?!

No wonder people go for Pistals or other brands. That's just crazy.

And $160 each for head gaskets?!

I want to support my local bike shops, but that's silly. I'm thinking some of these parts will be cheaper from overseas..

:confused:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
The good news is that I didn't find too much wrong. A few light scores on the cylinder walls, but that's about it. Piston to bore clearances are about 0.1 mm, or .004" (which is serviceable, if not ideal).

Probably testifies to quality improvements in engineering over the years. And the Motul 4T oil. I haven't pulled down earlier Ducatis at that mileage to find them in such good condition.

But the parts prices are crazy. No-one could afford or justify that sort of money (plus labour) to rebuild their engine. I can barely justify it, and I do all my own work.

I guess this is where modern bike repairs are nowadays. Between heavenly parts prices, and increasing labour charges, repairing them isn't really economical.

They really have become disposable. Sad.

:(
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,501 Posts
WOW unbelievable pricing on the piston rings. I'd just go with the Pistal pistons, bump up the compression slightly and they probably need replacing due to wear anyway.

Yea, its costly to own Ducati's today. Its absolutely amazing to me how much they charge for parts. Thats why there are so many aftermarket solutions available. Simply ditch the stock crap and put in aftermarket. Even the gasket kits are available from other manufactures.

Sounds like you'll be doing a new parts order from Europe or the US! heh ;)

Have you taken the crank out, or are you just doing a top end? I'd be very interested to see those big end crank bearings. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
OK. Just clarified the rings pricing, after some lengthy 'phone calls.
Looks like Ducati only supply a complete piston assembly now, and the rings part number supersedes to the piston number.
Which I guess represents better value than it seemed at first. But these pistons don't actually need replacing..
And yes Tye - I have the crank apart. The shells actually look OK, but of course I will replace them. And the conrod bolts too I guess, at great expense to the management..
I've got to go out and pick up my cylinders now, but I'll post pics of the big-ends tonight. The pin is perfect - right on size - and the shells don't look bad.
So I guess some of the 1098 horror stories don't affect every owner. This thing looks beautiful inside.
Just as well, with parts prices like these!

:(
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
WOW unbelievable pricing on the piston rings. I'd just go with the Pistal pistons, bump up the compression slightly and they probably need replacing due to wear anyway.

Yea, its costly to own Ducati's today. Its absolutely amazing to me how much they charge for parts. Thats why there are so many aftermarket solutions available. Simply ditch the stock crap and put in aftermarket. Even the gasket kits are available from other manufactures.

Sounds like you'll be doing a new parts order from Europe or the US! heh ;)

Have you taken the crank out, or are you just doing a top end? I'd be very interested to see those big end crank bearings. ;)
Actually Tye your advice to "ditch the stock crap and put in aftermarket" is probably a bit simplistic. The fact is the "stock crap" has done a great job, to look like that after that mileage.
And my Florida mate (with the full-on Ducshop engine in his 999R track bike) had a failure at the end of our Jennings track days - a broken Pistal piston.
If I get a complete new stock piston assembly for a little over $500 (and the no-longer-supplied ring sets were going to be $218 retail anyway) I'll probably go for that.
Might pick up a thou or so on my piston/bore clearance.
But if anyone can supply me ring sets for the 1098 send me a PM.
Thanks.
 

·
Court Jester
Joined
·
11,816 Posts
Thanks for posting up Pat I'm looking forward to watching this thread.

Stupid question.. had you not tore it down what signs if any would you of seen (performance wise)? Or do you think at some point you would of had a failure causing more damage?

Just trying to get a sense of where I'm at and going with mine I'll be well past 24k miles at the end of the summer and due for my valve shims, did them at 16k miles and I sanded them as close as I could get.

Also have you always used Motul? I just switched at 22k miles to mobile 1.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,501 Posts
Actually Tye your advice to "ditch the stock crap and put in aftermarket" is probably a bit simplistic. The fact is the "stock crap" has done a great job, to look like that after that mileage.
Well, my statement came from frustration on the quoted pricing. You can go two ways with motor building as you well know; reliable or powerful. You can't get both and Ducati's had quite a few reliability issues with many of these motors as we've played witness to recently on these here forms. So it just made sense to maybe try something else. But your right, if it worked this long, OEM replacements should last the same amount if not more.

Good news on those bearing shells. Don't forget to swap the main bearings with the older 999 versions, thats a highly recommended update. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
564 Posts
Out of curiousity Pat, how many miles did you have on your 1098 before it needed the rebuild? I'm excited to see this thread though, best of luck with your endeavours!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,533 Posts
Athena Complete Top End Gasket Kit for 1098 & SF. Kit includes everything from the base gaskets up. Athena is the OE Supplier to Ducati. Made in Italy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Thanks for your interest. As to the mileage - just over 76,000 kms, which is just short of 50,000 mi. Not that many for a modern engine.
But the engine is still in good condition. The minor scuffing on the cylinders completely disappeared after a light hone. The crank and 'rod bearings look fine.
Not sure how visible the crank bearings will come out in the pics, but as you can see there is no serious wear or copper showing.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
159 Posts
Ah Pat, so the motor is dis-assembled at only 76k kms. You have unintentionally pricked my red balloon. Amongst all the Ducati doom and gloom, your voice was one of stability and reliability. Despite the condition that you have found the motor to be in, that voice is now silenced.:(
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
A few pics along the way. You will see I strip a lot of the engine in the bike, which makes it much easier to remove on my own.
The heads are a bit 'squeezy' to take off and on in the bike, but can be done with a modified spanner. Removing the flywheel while the engine is still mounted gives a solid base to work from.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,787 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Sorry if I have disappointed you Rockit! Not my intention..

To be clear - I was encouraged to dismantle my engine by a few factors.

1. My oil light was not extinguishing immediately when started with the engine hot. This was probably due to a failing oil pressure switch, but I was happy to go through the engine anyway.

2. These engines need new piston rings about this mileage. This is an opinion I have developed over 40 years of working on Ducati twins.

3. I intend keeping this bike for a long time. That was always part of my planned ownership, and involves the considerable spending I have done to improve/lighten the bike.

4. It is mid-winter here, and I have a short holiday. Also, tearing the motor right down not only permits me to check and replace any necessary parts, but also allows me access to replace the last few remaining bolts I haven't yet replaced in titanium..

:D

Apologies if that has cost you a 'voice of reason', but be assured that I will be open and honest as to what I find. No fear or favour..

But I have found very little wear, which should reassure those wondering how long our lovely bikes can be expected to last. And prove/disprove opinions expressed on here as to the longevity and reliability of these expensive machines.

As a general comment, I can say I have quite enjoyed working on a later model than most I have rebuilt. They are a well-sorted machine in most respects.

And it's nice finding the factory have now drilled all the same holes I used to add to earlier versions..

:)
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,501 Posts
Nice pix Pat, thanks for that. Your crank bearings are in excellent shape. They're in better shape then ANY Ducati I've worked on, low mileage or high mileage… *Reminder, we use the same oil.

I've never seen a Ducati with 50k miles in anything else but disastrous condition. In fact, your the only 1098/1198 I've seen LAST to 50k miles. SO either its how you ride it (my assumption) or your bike is one special machine. :shrug:

Good stuff though and I can't wait for more pix when ya got them! Especially pistons and cylinders, I bet they look perfect as well.
 
1 - 20 of 156 Posts
Top