[orionengnr]

Hello all, and Merry Christmas. First post here.
I bought a wrecked 2006 S2R a couple weeks ago. It had been sitting for three years. The owner had bought it from an insurance auction and has not done anything with it...finally sold it.

Okay, when I went to look at it, he connected a battery pack and the engine turned over on the starter, so I bought it.

Now I have drained/cleaned the tank, got the fuel pump working, fit a fresh battery, and attempted to start it. Gauges sweep, lights light up, but nothing happens when I hit the starter button. If I connect 12v to the starter post directly, engine turns, but no spark.

I don't know enough about the immobiliser, but I suspect I'm going to learn.
Only key is the black key in the ignition when it was wrecked.
Are there any codes, or anything I can read to determine what is going on here?

Thanks to all.
Best, Rich

 

[Tuned]

Welcome to the forum Rich!

Well, I wouldn't think about the immobilizer being the problem, it's rare. If there was an issue, there would be a very clear error message on the LCD panel located on the dashboard. If you don't see anything glaringly obvious, then you probably don't have an issue.

The starter button won't activate unless certain parameters are present.

- The ignition switch needs to be on (obvious)
- The key needs to be switched to the on position (obvious)
- The kickstand needs to be up (not so obvious)
- The bike needs to be in neutral (not so obvious)

A lot of times the neutral safety switch is broken, so the computer doesn't know its in neutral. Other times, the kickstand safety switch is unplugged or broken and again, the computer doesn't know that either. So those are the two areas I'd focus on first, before even beginning to think about the immobilizer.

 

[orionengnr]

Thank you for the welcome, and the info.
Since I bought the bike wrecked, I have no owner's manual (searching for one on eBay).
Same with Service Manual (just ordered a CD on eBay).
So I have no idea what "normal indications" are to be expected.
I will check the sidestand switch, and probably bypass it just to be sure.
When I went to look at the bike, the seller used a battery jumper-pack to power up the gauges, and we got the engine to turn over. I'm wondering if we damaged a relay or the ECU in that process.
Once I have the owners/service manuals with decent wiring diagrams I will have more to go on.

Thanks again, and if there is anything I can check/rule out in the meantime, please let me know. I have a multimeter and I'm not afraid to use it!

Best regards, Rich

 

[Tuned]

I've used car batteries to jump these bikes no problem, so I doubt it caused damage. However, maybe the line to the solenoid is simply unplugged? I'd investigate all the cabling/wiring since you replaced the battery. Usually even with a dead battery the starter will at least make a click noise to indicate it's trying.

Another question… do you hear the fuel pump prime when you turn on the ignition?

 

[orionengnr]

Thanks again.
1. I am getting the solenoid "click"...just one click for each press of the starter button.
2. Fuel pump is still (intentionally) disconnected. There was about a gallon on rusty water in the tank. Drained, cleaned, replaced filter, and ran pump using battery charger. Pretty sure pump will be okay. As soon as the engine will turn over, and I can confirm spark, I will reconnect the fuel pump and put some fuel in it.

Still waiting on the service and owner's manuals )wiring diagrams and text on normal operation).
Any insight on what "normal" is? If gauges sweep, and solenoid clicks, may I rule out an immo problem?

Best regards, Rich

 

[Tuned]

I still think your battery has no amperage. Just because it has voltage, doesn't mean it has the necessary amp's to turn the engine over. I'd get some jumper cables out, run them to a car and see what happens. Bet it starts right up and if it does… then your battery is bad.

So far everything sounds normal, the solenoid clicking is the best evidence of bad battery there is.

 

[orionengnr]

Tuned--
thanks for taking the time to reply, several times over.

You are correct, the battery is crap. But...I have a fresh battery (from a watercraft) and it has good amps. I have hooked the jumper cables to that. Still no crank.

The other day, I hooked some jumper cables up to the "big battery--positive directly from the "big" battery to the starter lug, negative lead to the battery and tapped it against the exhaust flange on the cylinder head. Motor turns, although a lot more slowly than I expected (plugs are out).

And...no spark at the plugs.

So, to summarize:

Lights/gauges light up. Gauges sweep. Engine does not turn using starter button (even with "big" battery jumped in). Solenoid clicks.

Given all that, may I rule out the immo?

Engine will turn with 12v applied directly to starter, but slowly...

Once I have a real wiring diagram I may be able to do something...right now, I'm fishing and fumbling in the dark.

Thanks again, and best regards, Rich.

 

[Tuned]

It could still be an immobilizer issue for sure, but I still think your tests aren't adequate enough to rule that out. I assume you've checked all the fuses… plus backtracked what you did since you heard the engine turn over last.

The slow turning starter is not a good sign at all. The solenoid could be fried due to the engine not wanting to turn over and too much stress put on the system. So perhaps the first thing to do is measure the solenoid trigger wires, make sure it's actually getting a trigger. If it is, then you know without a doubt the immobilizer is not the problem. Then if everything check's out, I'd pull the starter and see how fast it spins on the bench. The other thing is to buy a Ducati engine turning tool and turn the engine over by hand. That will help you diagnose a lot! If everything feels fine, then you can rule out potential engine failure as being one of the problems.

The wiring diagram won't help much because they don't explain the start procedure OR explain why certain paths are made. The service manual will include some testing procedures, but that's it, nothing really helpful.

Remember, it's just an engine. There is nothing special about it besides the label Ducati on the side. So don't over-think the diagnosing process. I already listed the "got-ya's" and the starting procedure. So all you've gotta do is measure those sensors and make sure they function.

Anyway, sorry I can't be of much more help… electrical gremlins are hard to diagnose remotely. It's so much easier when your in front of the bike and have the appropriate know-how/tools.

 

[orionengnr]

Again, Tuned..my thanks.

I got tired and disgusted, and took some of the thickest wire I had, and crimped some terminal ends on.

Not sure how large it was, but it was large enough.

I connected those leads from the watercraft battery to the Monster battery, and hit the start button (plugs still out).

The engine cranked over, (still no spark) and when I let go of the button, the starter continued to crank.

Shutting off the key fixed that.

Same thing happened with each succeeding attempt.

So I am guessing that I have a solenoid issue. And that is only the beginning.

But the engine turns, so I am willing to spend some money on forks/front wheel/rotors/etc.

Thanks again for your efforts.
Best, Rich

 

[Tuned]

Yep, sounds like you got it figured out!

Let us know if you have any more questions!

 

[kihtay]

I was getting ready to load my S2r up and head to COTA and it wouldn't start the night before. I went through every possible diagnostic for it, so I have quite a bit of experience with that.

Also one of the common failures as the s2r is getting older is that the antenna ring that goes under the key guard will crack and when it does, the bike will immobilize.

 

[orionengnr]

Thank you, but I still don't know what the symptoms of the immobilizer actuation are.

Will the engine crank, but not start (due to no spark)?

Because that is what I have.

So i don't know if I have an immo issue, or something else.

 

[Tuned]

If the immobilizer doesn't work, it will not turn over the starter motor.

 

[orionengnr]

Thank you.
That tells me that my problem is elsewhere.

 

[kihtay]

^Yes it will act like a dead battery, but the lights will still work